Are adoptees in Denmark citizens? LWID S3E25 (replay)

Adoptees or immigrants? In this highlight from season 3, Golda and Katie explore the Danish government’s attempt to reclassify internationally adopted citizens as immigrants under a welfare policy update. The move, which would have applied retroactively to 1968, sparked outrage and confusion. Many adoptees—raised entirely in Denmark—were left questioning their citizenship. 

During season break we're revisiting some of the most popular segments from season 3. We'll be back with season 4 in August!

Full episode: 

https://lwidpodcast.buzzsprout.com/2209797/episodes/16714268-phone-bans-us-products-boycott-backlash-against-workfare-law-lwid-s3e6

In this episode:

Cohosts: 

• Golda - https://www.linkedin.com/in/goldafania/
• Katie - https://www.linkedin.com/in/katherineeburns/

Podcast Manager:

• Stephanie - https://www.linkedin.com/in/dstephfuccio/

Audio Editor: 

• Cecilia - https://www.linkedin.com/in/ceciliagfoster/

Transcript Editor:

• Larissa 

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Transcript

Welcome to the Last Week in Denmark Podcast. Each week, two of our community members talk through the top Danish news, stories and developments, sharing personal insights and international perspectives. If you're an international living in Denmark or thinking of moving here, you'll want to listen to many of these episodes. We've got three complete seasons of them for you. During our summer break, we wanted to share with you some highlights from the most recent season. This week we're revisiting a conversation that Katie and Golda had about Denmark's change in adoptees Danish citizenship status from episode six. We'll have the link to the full episode in the show Notes for you. If you enjoy this clip, please screenshot the episode and share it on social media. We are here to help internationals in Denmark stay informed and feel connected. Thanks for your help  reaching more international.

Katie

The government got into trouble this week after they classified adoptees from abroad as immigrants. So this is something that kind of unfolded over the last few days this week and it's just ridiculous.

Golda

I think this is absolutely wild. Like... I'm just... I'm shocked. Like I'm actually genuinely shocked. Like what country has ever done this? I mean, I stand to be corrected, if there is a country that has  done this.

Katie

This was, and they're rightly so, again, like was so much outrage over this and there should have been. So I suppose just to kind of step back, because it obviously happened over a number of days. So there was going to be an update to workfare policy in Denmark. So that's where if you're coming from outside Denmark, you need to contribute to society to get the welfare and that usually do that through working or internships or whatever for a certain number of hours per week. And up until now that's only gone back to people, who entered Denmark since January 2008. But now they want to put it back to the 2nd of April 1968. So it applies to anybody who's come in 1968

Golda

 1968?

Katie

 I know it's weird that they picked 2nd of April for some reason. That's actually when the CPR number system came in. Because I was like, why the 2nd of April? Why does it feel so suspicious? But basically in trying to , like, to change this or make this what seems like kind of a smaller update to a policy, they basically said that people, who were adopted by Danish people in Denmark. So like when Danish people adopted someone from another country, they basically said they don't count as Danish people in this new legislation. It's like how, like this is like beyond an oversight. Like how, how could you possibly have made this mistake. And it.. it's.. it's... there's so many, like, heartbreaking stories of people being like, well, am I still Danish now? Do I still count as Danish? When obviously they are Danish. They have grown up in Denmark. They are just 100% of Danish people. So it's just, I think even there's like that crazy politician, what's his name? It's like Nick Zimmerman or something. Even he's outraged and he doesn't seem like a great person. So that's, I think that's like not good, its crazy.

Golda

Yeah, I think it's actually wild. Especially because all the conversation around international adoption and the banning of international adoption and that was created because the adoptees were actually coming out and talking about their experience, you know, being adopted in Denmark and not feeling as part of the society and losing part of their identity to be adopted in Denmark. And then now the government is like, yeah, we hear how you feel and you're actually not Danish. Like what? Like, way to validate my emotions. I'm just like, this, this cannot be real. First of all, if you're born in Denmark and you're not born to at least one Danish parent, so like Danish citizen, you're already not considered Danish. So there's actually quite a few people who are probably like, born to parents are... what's it called,  - "opholdstilladelse" -  , Permanent residency, who are stateless. That's already one. And they've been really fighting for that because you, you're raised in Denmark your entire life, you know, no other country than, than Denmark. And then two. Those people who were adopted, if we're going back to like 1968, were probably adopted as babies. So are you saying that a baby didn't, like, has to contribute to society in order to get, like, when, what are we starting? Or should they be teenagers and start contributing before they can qualify? Like, I just feel like it's getting, it's getting a lot... it's... it's getting to be a lot. I think this access to certain rights and services. I do understand that they, like, the government feels people are abusing the welfare system, but we also have to understand that whether you're a citizen or not, you still contribute. Like, you still pay taxes. Anybody who has a, you know, CPR number, pays taxes.

Katie

Yeah.

Golda

So it's... hmmm... I, I'm kind of like, this is really.... I, I understand the outrage and I sympathize a lot and I'm just like, I don't think this should even have come up, I think there are other priorities they could have focused on.

Katie

Yeah, I think the big question is, like, how could they let this happen? So, like, obviously, with all of the outrage, they're scrambling around to kind of contain the damage and be like, look, we're going to fix it, we're going to look at it and it's like, okay, but you're making a law. What did you check? What have you looked into? Has this been checked thoroughly to make sure there are no other parties that are going to be affected? That absolutely shouldn't. I agree as well, in the sense of, like, okay, I see where they're coming from in changing the policy and updating it to make sure no one's taking advantage of the welfare system. But I do wonder, like, in Ireland, I do think the Irish government is very, very good at making us blame the people, who have nothing. So it is like, okay, there are people in Ireland who abuse the welfare system, but our welfare system isn't very good. It's not like they have a lot. They're not getting a lot out of it. It's not a good quality of life. And, like, it's very easy to demonize, you know, those people. Actually, I saw something that was quite interesting that said, really, it's the people on welfare who are putting almost 100% of the money they get back into society because they have so little. So, like, that I get paid, obviously, I pay my taxes, but then I have money at the end of the month. But I also have savings, I go on holidays, things like that. So my money goes to other places. But if I'm on welfare, I don't have a lot. So I am spending all that money on the essentials that are food and things around me, that are going back into the society.

Golda

And you can't travel.

Katie

Yeah, exactly.

Golda

 To get that approved. 

Katie

 This is giving me kind of reminding me of home, where it's like, oh, we're kind of demonizing a group of people, who really don't have a lot and, kind of, making sure they can't get any more than the bare minimum. So I don't love that in the first place, but the fact that this just made such... this huge oversight for these people who are absolutely Danish citizens, that tells me that they're not paying attention to this law. And that kind of tells me that the rhetoric around this law just feels a little more insidious than you want your laws to be. Like, it doesn't feel like the good of Denmark necessarily, if they're going to make a big mistake like that. And then suddenly be like, oh, no, no, we're going to change it. And it's like, this mistake shouldn't have been made in the first place. Do you have adult supervision for this law?

Golda

Priorities, people, priorities. But also, I'm just thinking, as a parent, how I would feel for someone to tell me, that my child, that I adopted. Like, parents don't adopt their children thinking, yeah, this is, you know, this is , a separate child from my child, it's not really my child. You know, like, most people who adopt go in thinking, this is my child  and they raised them as their children, which means if I'm Danish, you're Danish. Like, we're... we're... we're a Danish family. So for the government to be like, nope, you signing papers does not make your child Danish. It's just. It's a bit inconsiderate. I'm just saying.

Katie

Inconsiderate. Absolute nonsense. Yes, absolutely.

Golda

I'm just trying to be really nice here because, yeah, this kind of shocked me a little bit.

Katie

So, yeah, this feels like a Trump level kind of mistake. So it's like, oh, right, you do better, you know, better than this.

Golda

Yeah, Come on now... Denmark..

Hey, this is Kalpita and Golda, co hosts of the Last Week in Denmark podcast. Did you know Last Week in Denmark offers sponsored content in the newsletter? Our reporters are producing original articles and content tailored for internationals in Denmark. So if you have a business our readers should know about, let us write about it. Get in touch with us at reporterwid.dk. you can also reach out to us on LinkedIn and Instagram @Last Weekendenmark.